The fresh genealogists most of the contemplate it high you to definitely Nicholas’ wife Clementia was included here while the, significantly less than typical products, she would never be mentioned. When Susanna at particular afterwards go out gotten out over a unique guardian, the brand new wife of these guardian wasn’t mentioned.
This should signify Queen John spent a little while there and you will the potential for a keen amorous liaison that have Clementia can be acquired
Here are some let me reveal a theory advanced because of the certain eminent genealogists, but it’s reasonable to say that the new results is hotly competitive!
That it theory leads to a wonderful and you can interested ‘twist’ on the tale out-of Joanna, that could attract admirers of HBD!
At first glance, there would be absolutely nothing to strongly recommend one connection amongst the hostage, Susanna out-of Wales and you will Clementia, wife of Nicholas de Verdun. not, the experience of particular genealogists with foreign hostages, such as for instance young ones, might have been which they were usually put which have loved ones, or no was indeed readily available.
Moving forward to 1236, there is certainly an entry on Tewkesbury annals which relates to Joanna’s mom while the “King Clemencie!” It reads to some extent:
Today, it is known that mom from Joanna are entitled Clementia (Clemence?
In this case the latest monk are evidently indulging when you look at the gothic legalism. Just before their unique demise, Joanna got legitimised by Pope. Based on one legitimisation, the newest Tewksbury monk obviously got it upon himself to elevate Joanna’s mother with the status regarding King, since if her mother ended up being King John’s spouse! It is true although not, you to definitely Queen John and you will Clementia was in fact never partnered. By writing on Joanna’s mom since “Queen” Clementia, new monk whom registered Joanna’s demise try proving their tall regard getting Joanna https://brightwomen.net/tr/dominik-kadin/, yet not trying to alter the genuine circumstances.
When it comes to name away from Clementia de Verdun, Paget signifies that she was the newest child from Roger de- Dauntsey, regarding Wiltshire. You to genealogist considers they high one to Clementia acclaimed of Wiltshire as the he’s realized that Queen John had a powerful connection in order to you to state, it being the household out-of their most trusted partners, the Longespee, ilies and you can Geoffrey Fitz Peter.
Genealogists found the label ‘Clementia’ try extremely uncommon certainly one of English noblewomen on the period. In one single dining table from ladies names that has been compiled, there were merely two events of one’s label “Clementia” out-of all in all, 1407 women in the fresh sample! The truth that some body called Clementia would-be of the Susanna is recognized as significant.
Very! The evidence try effective, however conclusive, that inside 1228, Susanna, since an effective hostage, gotten off to the proper care of their own maternal grandma, today partner of Nicholas de Verdun!!
The new Scottish genealogists of one’s MacDuffs’ keep one Susanna ferch Llywelyn was created 1214 during the Gwynnedd, Wales and died c. 1259 from inside the Dunfermline, Fife, Scotland. She partnered Malcolm MacDuff, Earl out-of Fife in 1230 along with a couple people: Sir Colbran MacDuff, Earl of Fife, born 1245, died 1270 and you may MacDuff MacDuff created 1247.
Of course, discover prevent objections to all or any so it conjecture! King John got of a lot mistresses and possibly as much as 7 illegitimate pupils. Mom from Joanna might have been produced circa 1172 and you may marriageable circa 1184. Joanna herself came into this world circa 1191 (fourteen yrs old in the course of their unique relationship so you’re able to Llywelyn). Rohese, the understood legitimate daughter from Nicholas de Verdun along with his wife Clementia was born circa 1210-1213. In the event the Clementia is actually the mother regarding Joanna, she’d are located in their particular late 30’s, very early 40’s whenever giving birth in order to Rohese! Maybe not hopeless, some say, but unlikely.